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Does Nexon Have Rights To Dark And Darker Art? - Dark \u0026 Darker News
Dark and Darker
2023年03月30日 18:10
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 07:58
I'll be sure to keep bringing you updates as they come :) thanks for being here everyone.
D B2023/03/29(水) 10:39
@Anonimo Lindo I mean, technically, two of the names are different Tanker/Fighter and Thief/Rogue. Plus it’s literally all DND classes
Anonimo Lindo2023/03/29(水) 10:58
@Onepeg no icefrog wasnt a blizard employe, also blyzzard terms of service for maps amde in warcraft 3 didnt protect blyzzard. icefrog had no contract of employment with blyzard when he made dota, dont spread lies
Itz Lunar2023/03/29(水) 11:17
Mr Onepeg did you check out the video Devin Nash did?
HypnoticRaven2023/03/30(木) 12:34
BSG should sue dark and darker for idea theft as there is a mechanic during night raids where you can hide in shadowed areas and shoot out lights (torches) with these things called bullets... 😜 jk
Shannen2023/03/30(木) 12:35
I am on Iron Maces side and understand prior art and the "proof" rebuttal provided but reading the Korean laws and looking at it from an IP standpoint not specifically the ideas and code which Iron Mace is provided rebuttals for BUT instead from the overlooked part of IP where the techniques and specific knowledge gained while working there is actually owned by Nexon... the fact they used the exact same paid assets HURTS them as it can be argued that the knowledge on how to take each separate asset and merge them (especially in such a similar way) is IP owned by Nexon along with the idea that they used knowledge (IP) they obtained working on P3 to avoid multiple design pitfalls and large iteration time.
Decayy2023/03/30(木) 08:52
The dangerous thing about this lawsuit is that if an artist makes art for a company, is that they can never make similar art for a similar project again. Which is completely bogus. You don't own someone after they leave a company forever
jmbrady12023/03/30(木) 07:45
seems like Nexon is trying to lay claim to an idea which legally they can't do so
Socialization2023/03/30(木) 06:57
So where's the asset purchase history? You don't just go around telling people that you bought a game by showing steam store page.
The Ticass Show2023/03/30(木) 06:46
I mean, this just feels like a bunch of copium at this point,
Is Dark and Darker good, yes ?
Was it "Stolen", no
Was it "Copied" oh definitly, 100% one of them knew exactly how p3 worked and recreated what he remembered of it. I'm still on Iron Mace's side, but common, "Our knight is different therefore we did not copy this"... Of course they wouldn't copy it 100% like the original one...
Like one guy pointed in a video, yes it's just a bunch of Unreal assets, but it's how they are placed, how you interact with them, the style, the vibe, etc... The mechanics, that you can "Steal". And I'm pretty sure they done it and now they're trying to cover their asses lol, Nexon is still greedy as hell so I root for their failure in this lawsuit, but I belive Iron Mace is not 100% innocent
Is Dark and Darker good, yes ?
Was it "Stolen", no
Was it "Copied" oh definitly, 100% one of them knew exactly how p3 worked and recreated what he remembered of it. I'm still on Iron Mace's side, but common, "Our knight is different therefore we did not copy this"... Of course they wouldn't copy it 100% like the original one...
Like one guy pointed in a video, yes it's just a bunch of Unreal assets, but it's how they are placed, how you interact with them, the style, the vibe, etc... The mechanics, that you can "Steal". And I'm pretty sure they done it and now they're trying to cover their asses lol, Nexon is still greedy as hell so I root for their failure in this lawsuit, but I belive Iron Mace is not 100% innocent
andrew hallard2023/03/30(木) 06:13
I feel like Nexon just wanted to stall their competition in any way to give them more time in their own production. If iron mace isn't continuing work on DnD despite this then they are fools. Although Nexon doesn't realize that this whole lawsuit has already doomed p3s launch. Just goes to show big corpo mindset vs gamer mindset
Chris S2023/03/30(木) 06:05
Am I the only one see an issue here with the fact DnD is releasing concept art(Correct me if i am missing nexon releasing this infobut..) of P3 when Nexon direct concept art which wouls still require approval from nexon even if it was a legal claim of the artist working at a another company and unless the aritist was a solo contractor hire by nexon wouldnt this show that they are retaining stolen data?
I maybe wrong but... again it doesnt look good, based on the insperation for certain concept art it does show there was timer invested in this but was this logged in meetings for proof of contecpt because it hard to say it was not done the same for nexon as well right?
people might think i am biased to wards nexon, but these are the points nexon will attack on so if you cant see these points your leaving your vitals argument points as fatal in a legal suit which is deadly, let alone don't get me wrong good press can help but your also leaving your self open for attacks from how your narrative is being prorated.
I maybe wrong but... again it doesnt look good, based on the insperation for certain concept art it does show there was timer invested in this but was this logged in meetings for proof of contecpt because it hard to say it was not done the same for nexon as well right?
people might think i am biased to wards nexon, but these are the points nexon will attack on so if you cant see these points your leaving your vitals argument points as fatal in a legal suit which is deadly, let alone don't get me wrong good press can help but your also leaving your self open for attacks from how your narrative is being prorated.
Paja Angus2023/03/30(木) 05:58
VAValve should sue Tencen to remove Riot Game for copying Dota and CCGO, according to Nexon Alkskafslkjaf
amNesia2023/03/30(木) 05:57
And Nexon would probably never fully release p3. Meanwhile everyone wants to play Dark n Darker. I’m ready to boycott Nexon, the bullies.
Belliger19912023/03/30(木) 05:31
Why is everyon so hell bent on 1/4 of the claim? And still getting it wrong... its not the classes it is the choice of art mixture and art style... I mean it can be a coincidence (easely proven by providing early design documents, which they do not show) But since 9 developers moved over from nexon while the project still was going, and that they had the sourcecode on private servers (over 1000 identical filenames in Dark and Darker) and simultanoiusly left the team (which criples every IT team/project instantly) has nothing todo with the classes...
Iron mace is a magician using the "look here..." trick for public support
Iron mace is a magician using the "look here..." trick for public support
QQleKK2023/03/30(木) 05:11
These artwork claims are just fucking childish. Like Jesus Christ, Nexon, are you for real...
Hunter Chapman2023/03/30(木) 03:29
I think they do look similar but that's because all fantasy characters have been stolen from Tolkien or dungeons and dragons so honestly Nexon could be sued by dungeons and dragons for using their characters but they can't because dungeons and dragons and Tolkien characters, besides a few specific ones , are now public domain. Atleast in America I don't how shit work in Korea but I still don't think this lawsuit will go anywhere unless the actual game code has been copied in anyway.
V.M.2023/03/30(木) 03:11
Goood i miss this game so much
Matt2023/03/30(木) 02:47
Everyone is straight up ignoring that Nexon's argument isn't just its similar therefore they stole it. Their argument is its similar because they got their idea's for everything from working at our company and in Korea you can't do that.
진진2023/03/30(木) 02:46
In fact, according to Iron Mays, At the secret table where the secret conversation between the company and the company takes place, when they were looking at each other, Nexon offered them to collaborate.They should have taken the opportunity. Many people say that dnd is a game that anyone can make, but we gave a lot of cheers and support to this game because it was more original, fun, and beautiful than anything else. Now many fans are in despair. Realistically, this game is completely over. Ahead of the final Betatest, their game was completely over and him permanently kicked out of the Korean industry.
Hubert Psotek2023/03/30(木) 02:31
Darker and darker is great, but devs **** up. They made great game, but didnt put effort to make thinks different from what they worked on in P3. Just look at that barbarian art. It is exactly the same as P3. Only helmet horns are missing. Its exactly same color palet. Blond hair, green cape, armor also looks quite same its just blurry, and both have in quite same position same bag. They can make now story its inspired by assassin's vikings, but comapred to P3 art here, can you really tell it was? I wouldn't be surprised if its concept art created in process of creating this final art for P3. Its just TOO similar.
I would say only warrior is really diffrent art.
Ranger? Diffrent style, at least different colors, but bag trap on same spots, gives me that feel its not used P3 concept art.
Mage has some similarities in clothing but as mages are usually "similar" and this one is older its quite diffrent.
And biggest issue is that game is made by exworkers that botrowed concept of project they were working on, to make it independently. And each similarity makes it worse. I dont think it will end well for game, but I hope im wrong. I wish that game was made by completely unrelated people, then there wont be any theft drama.
Also I heard wizards are working to limit profiting from their D&D IP. I wonder if it will have any effect on game that clamins to take alot from that IP and its name in short is also D&D.
I would say only warrior is really diffrent art.
Ranger? Diffrent style, at least different colors, but bag trap on same spots, gives me that feel its not used P3 concept art.
Mage has some similarities in clothing but as mages are usually "similar" and this one is older its quite diffrent.
And biggest issue is that game is made by exworkers that botrowed concept of project they were working on, to make it independently. And each similarity makes it worse. I dont think it will end well for game, but I hope im wrong. I wish that game was made by completely unrelated people, then there wont be any theft drama.
Also I heard wizards are working to limit profiting from their D&D IP. I wonder if it will have any effect on game that clamins to take alot from that IP and its name in short is also D&D.
razamondo2023/03/30(木) 02:23
20:50 The whole "you can't make X in Y time" argument has been so skewed by devs (mostly AAA) that have to jump through so many corporate hoops along with many other reasons so they take forever to get little to no results when even tiny teams of only a handful of people can build entire playable FUN games in just a few weeks and you can confirm this by looking at almost ANY team based game jam and seeing the amazing work that these tiny teams make in just 1-3 days.
Flowcomotion2023/03/30(木) 02:10
This copium will keep me going. where can i find that last jpeg of the 4 photos making oblivion look like DaD?
Kristopher Kitts2023/03/30(木) 01:58
I'm still not taking the side of someone who hasn't yet been proven to have created anything on their own. All I see is a bunch of guys who 'borrowed' art, an engine, models, and even their basic concept, so if someone has accused them of stealing their shit, I'm ready to listen to that and hear it out in full.
Ball Hair 20202023/03/30(木) 01:43
Everyone agrees Dark and Darker is fun to play and the idea of the game is great. No one ever said it was a wildly innovative or original saying Dark and Darker is Dungeons and Dragon, BR, Tarkov (Pvp,PVE) describes the game perfectly. The trends are showing that BR, Tarkov(Pvp,PVE) games are going to show up more and more. A BR, Tarkov game with coyboys or space scavengers, or samuri, or anime like characters, or pirates, or monster hunters. All of those game ideas are as original as Dark and Darker and it took me like 2 minutes to think come up with them.
SeeZaa2023/03/30(木) 01:37
There are no new ideas in gaming.. regardless of whether it is table top, pen&paper, or digital.. there are only alternative ways of considering, presenting, and experiencing them.
a much younger me, used to generate a new game every other month by randomly rolling from lists. They only appeared the same, to the common observer, because of the basic turn mechanics, and generic play style, of playing pen&paper, and as such also meant that those playing also had a sense of familiarity, no matter the setting.. be it medieval, futuristic, or any and all things between.
Discovery of P3 assets, format, mechanics, and narrative type, would show it to be no different than any other game, with inspiration from elsewhere, be it historical settings, common tropes, progressions style, narrative leaning etc etc.
The only common factor here is the artist, and unless it is a direct lift and copy, with no alteration, there is nothing to see. As for similar, or same asset labeling.. labelling is always, purposefully generic, for obvious reasons.
If you go through that list of asset names, and randomly search Google for images, there are pages and pages of examples.. some similar, some not so, and that is kind of the point isn't it?
A company may well own all the artwork directly produced for them, but that doesn't mean they own that artists style, thinking, or any of their prior, or future work that may exhibit similarities. It either is that piece of art, or it isn't.
a much younger me, used to generate a new game every other month by randomly rolling from lists. They only appeared the same, to the common observer, because of the basic turn mechanics, and generic play style, of playing pen&paper, and as such also meant that those playing also had a sense of familiarity, no matter the setting.. be it medieval, futuristic, or any and all things between.
Discovery of P3 assets, format, mechanics, and narrative type, would show it to be no different than any other game, with inspiration from elsewhere, be it historical settings, common tropes, progressions style, narrative leaning etc etc.
The only common factor here is the artist, and unless it is a direct lift and copy, with no alteration, there is nothing to see. As for similar, or same asset labeling.. labelling is always, purposefully generic, for obvious reasons.
If you go through that list of asset names, and randomly search Google for images, there are pages and pages of examples.. some similar, some not so, and that is kind of the point isn't it?
A company may well own all the artwork directly produced for them, but that doesn't mean they own that artists style, thinking, or any of their prior, or future work that may exhibit similarities. It either is that piece of art, or it isn't.
Tyler Brigham2023/03/30(木) 01:36
All of this is irrelevant. Unless they actually copy and pasted code or assets, you can copy style all you want. How many Minecraft style cube games are there? This is pretty petty
Henry Mitchell2023/03/30(木) 12:39
Can we start a charity to fund iron maces legal fees? #downwithnexon
Samoht Eel2023/03/30(木) 12:35
21:48 Don't you dare get Todd Howard thinking that he can claim the Dungeon Crawler genre. 😆
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 12:35
“They are completely different” Bro what are you talking about. All of these models are almost exactly the same as P3 What kind of DaD fan boy glazer shit is this
They are going to lose this case without a doubt Horrible video
They are going to lose this case without a doubt Horrible video
al ex2023/03/30(木) 12:20
holy shit of all the places i get to laius from the delicious dungeon whom just pops up as artist inspiration.
dorkovic2023/03/29(水) 11:34
Many people in the comments seem to miss the idea that Company A is claiming the devs and artists from Company B have stolen ideas and used them to create their own IP after they had been working for Company A. Someone else also said it: this is like the fcebook thing with Zuck and the twins, though it's not a copy, you could argue the idea was stolen and used to create a similar IP. If none of the devs or artists from Company B have been working for Company A in the past, Company A has no case to make. In this case though, Company A is, imho, justified to make a claim and I just hope that neither companies get hurt too badly in the process. I hope they settle and both games get released in the end. Healthy competition is a better ground for innovation and success than curbstomping each other.
-edit: Will admit that I'm not following the saga closely and could have misunderstood the base of the claims. I enjoyed D&D and have no quarrel with Nexon. I welcome anyone who cares to educate me.
-edit: Will admit that I'm not following the saga closely and could have misunderstood the base of the claims. I enjoyed D&D and have no quarrel with Nexon. I welcome anyone who cares to educate me.
Trizjoe2023/03/29(水) 11:32
People are way to focused on the lesser part of the case (the art). The problem lays in the issues with teams leaving with the concept & creative direction developed with X company only to build it themselves. Usually there are non contest clauses in place for this type of thing but we'll see what happens in court.
TheGazreal2023/03/29(水) 11:19
This is funny. Like the last video, I see that DnD fanboys are arguing for things like illustrations and file names that they might think are ambiguous issues.
Because they want to defend IronMace somehow, so they have to fool themselves. Wow... you guys must be blind.
According to Git log, which IronMace opened today, DnD has already completed planning and design and entered actual development before
the founding date of IronMace on October 21, 2021. Does this really make sense...?
Because they want to defend IronMace somehow, so they have to fool themselves. Wow... you guys must be blind.
According to Git log, which IronMace opened today, DnD has already completed planning and design and entered actual development before
the founding date of IronMace on October 21, 2021. Does this really make sense...?
Alpha Turtle2023/03/29(水) 11:10
If non of them had worked for Nexon, there would be no case. But the lead dev and 11 others who were heavily involved with P3 remade the project into dark and darker. If you cherry pick each one of these instances you can make the case that no one has the legal claim to dungeon crawlers but that's not the full picture. This was a migrated project and I'm sure with all this combined with a full timeline of each dev of P3 along with the devs employment contracts, this will probably turn into a facebook like situation when Mark Zuckerberg was hired to help create Harvard Connections but ended up ghosting on the original creators to make his own non exclusive international version of the idea as facebook. Its a very similar thing were you can argue all day it was similar but a different thing, different code, etc. It was a great move on his part but he did have to pay up. This is going to most likely be the case for Iron Mace, I don't think ether party wants to the project to fail at this point, How else are they all going to get paid?
shane walker2023/03/30(木) 12:10
Well, of course. What do you think was the end goal here? Nexon doesn't want the game to never come out... otherwise they wouldn't have waited to take legal action until after the game blew up during play testing. This is still, in my opinion, still a pay to win situation. Nexon saw how popular the game was, decided they could pay big money to use the legal system to get in on the action, and they will probably win via settlement and profit shares after the fact. Its how they do business.
If the game hadn't gotten any traction, especially on Twitch, I guarantee you we would never have heard a peep from Nexon.
If the game hadn't gotten any traction, especially on Twitch, I guarantee you we would never have heard a peep from Nexon.
Alpha Turtle2023/03/30(木) 06:41
@shane walker I may be mistaken but I think the CEO was already being sued by Nexon before it gained traction and maybe before he even formed Iron Mace?
shane walker2023/03/30(木) 07:16
@Alpha Turtle I think you are mistaken. This lawsuit hit well after the play test. The guy you're thinking of was just terminated from Nexon, but he wasn't getting sued. Not that I'm aware of.
DIGI ROSS2023/03/29(水) 11:09
Ironmace will be in the clear, it will just take awhile for either Nexon or the courts to end this.
Michael Crandall2023/03/29(水) 11:05
Yea hopefully the judge will see right through NEXONS bs cause thier grading at straws on this one.
Louis Nguyen2023/03/29(水) 11:03
We love rooting for the underdog, especially when they’re giving us what we want, but legally, nexon will bury ironmace with the budgeting they have for bullying competition out of their way, a sad life corporate companies live
Tyler2023/03/29(水) 10:59
I hope that Iron Mace wins the case to concentrate more on the game. Obviously the same artist would produce similar looking designs so Nexon has an easy Target.
MS2023/03/29(水) 10:49
I have zero interest in this game, but now I'm kind of invested in this story. Thanks for the coverage
PandaBrrr2023/03/30(木) 04:15
Games great, if and when if comes back hit it up!
Ian2023/03/29(水) 10:43
If they can find a settlement that would probably be best.
To the points of the video, fair enough, but it is clear that Ironmace employees learned of the current D&D concept by working on it at Nexon. In terms of what I think the "spirit of the law" is, Ironmace clearly violated their contract by learning about a specific concept/idea generated within Nexon and then leaving to form their own company for that specific idea (even if it is an idea based on publicly available concepts, since that is true of almost any idea). Even if the Ironmace employees were the only people to come up with the idea at Nexon, it is technically part of their contract that pursuit of such ideas within the company would then become owned by the company. If they came up with the idea themselves and never worked on it while on the job then that would be something else, but that is clearly not the case here. It isn't even clear that the Ironmace employees are the ones who came up with the original concept, perhaps someone who is still at Nexon is the true creator. (though multiple people probably contributed)
It is important to note that P3 seems to be in super early stages, was discontinued/shelved, and many of the relevant assets are publicly available for purchase, so I hope that Ironmace is allowed to continue on the project. It doesn't seem moral that Ironmace should be banned from ever working on a game concept that they believed in when their employer gave up on it. At the same time, Nexon (its employees) did facilitate the creation and some development of the game concept, so they are owed something I think.
It is possible the courts would rule in Ironmace's favor if ruling on the current evidence by the letter of the law, since the current evidence does seem kind of thin, but based on the timetable of events, and everything else, I think most of the key elements are somewhat obvious.
Great game, and it would be a shame if Ironmace is unfairly punished since someone else will probably make a clone before Nexon could capitalize anyways. Ironmace are the ones who managed to make the game a hit, so ultimately they should be the greatest benefactors.
To the points of the video, fair enough, but it is clear that Ironmace employees learned of the current D&D concept by working on it at Nexon. In terms of what I think the "spirit of the law" is, Ironmace clearly violated their contract by learning about a specific concept/idea generated within Nexon and then leaving to form their own company for that specific idea (even if it is an idea based on publicly available concepts, since that is true of almost any idea). Even if the Ironmace employees were the only people to come up with the idea at Nexon, it is technically part of their contract that pursuit of such ideas within the company would then become owned by the company. If they came up with the idea themselves and never worked on it while on the job then that would be something else, but that is clearly not the case here. It isn't even clear that the Ironmace employees are the ones who came up with the original concept, perhaps someone who is still at Nexon is the true creator. (though multiple people probably contributed)
It is important to note that P3 seems to be in super early stages, was discontinued/shelved, and many of the relevant assets are publicly available for purchase, so I hope that Ironmace is allowed to continue on the project. It doesn't seem moral that Ironmace should be banned from ever working on a game concept that they believed in when their employer gave up on it. At the same time, Nexon (its employees) did facilitate the creation and some development of the game concept, so they are owed something I think.
It is possible the courts would rule in Ironmace's favor if ruling on the current evidence by the letter of the law, since the current evidence does seem kind of thin, but based on the timetable of events, and everything else, I think most of the key elements are somewhat obvious.
Great game, and it would be a shame if Ironmace is unfairly punished since someone else will probably make a clone before Nexon could capitalize anyways. Ironmace are the ones who managed to make the game a hit, so ultimately they should be the greatest benefactors.
VividHazE2023/03/29(水) 10:39
LETS MAKE THEM THE FOOK YOU MONEY SOMEONE MAKE A DONATE THING
kaleb hopewilcom2023/03/29(水) 10:38
well shit we will just have to make barbs look like ugandan warriors now and clerics will have to look like japanese samurai or else nexon gonna find you.
Austin Monczka2023/03/29(水) 10:38
im sorry but with nexiom not having any thing but one scrren shot to go off of i feel that iron mace has this one unless they drop all the real info in court but i doubt it
SuperGreenqueen2023/03/29(水) 10:37
qu xai shang
MrDaniloko232023/03/29(水) 10:33
Nexon
Is
FULL OF SHIT
Is
FULL OF SHIT
henkingu2023/03/29(水) 10:32
copium is starting to run low, huh?!
They Call Me Peanutbutter2023/03/29(水) 10:26
this is like Wizards of the coast trying to make people who make their own campaigns and sell them to others. Foolish greed, it never pays off. I truly hope they don't end up getting derailed due to this frivolous lawsuit
Jswayb5032023/03/29(水) 10:24
Honestly it has no merit bc they canceled the game from nexon
Your friendly neighborhood Shitposter2023/03/29(水) 10:23
Those aren't soulsborne references those are mordhau and For Honor references...
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 10:27
Half of those fighters were DS concept art, specifically ds1 and ds3
Your friendly neighborhood Shitposter2023/03/29(水) 10:45
@Onepeg reverse image search them lmao, one of them is literally a screenshot from Mordhau
LeonArdo2023/03/29(水) 10:22
Wonderful now Ubisoft will sue them for steal the Vikings concept well done well done😮
It's a joke ofc
It's a joke ofc
Kay2023/03/29(水) 10:15
Im sorry but who gives a fuck if the classes look the same... an apple will look like a fucking apple in every other game too! This is so dumb
Jack's Complete Lack of Suprise2023/03/29(水) 10:09
I mean lets be realistic. Dark and Darker is using the visual style and concept of P3, but it is not the same game and was built from ground up. So depending on Korean laws, Nexon could win because it is obviously very similar of a game. But if it was western laws, Nexon would never win, you can't copyright a genre. Idk why people are pretending D&D is not ripping off p3. Having said that, fuck Nexon and I love Ironmace and I hope D&D wins.
wes morris2023/03/29(水) 10:04
looks more and more every day that just the concept art itself confused nexon. With them not realizing literally the same artist made them. To an uneducated eye they do look the same cause the same hands made them. I bet someone is just like THAT ART LOOKS LIKE OUR ART THEY STOLE. not considering the artist may be the same guy
PrivateJayy2023/03/29(水) 10:04
The goblin cave is featured in the steam video for dark and darker from way before it was made, which means it was something that they had already worked on and was not done in 6 weeks from scratch
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 10:28
It was. A couple of animations isn’t the same thing as a completely fleshed out dungeon.
J Y2023/03/29(水) 10:01
Is it standard procedure to constantly update the public via Discord while there's an ongoing legal dispute?
Seems like they know they're fucked legally and want the public opinion to be on their side LOL.
Seems like they know they're fucked legally and want the public opinion to be on their side LOL.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 10:28
Considering that prior to any DMCA claim Nexon went to the press and tried to bury them in the same public opinion, I’d say this is fair game.
iTresR2023/03/29(水) 09:54
Nexon has 2 big fps games coming out soon, one is the finals, and the other I forgot the name of. Do you guys think getting a petition going to boycot the upcoming nexon games would do anything? The finals has already proved that it will be decently successful at least initially upon release. And the other game looks genuinely pretty good and even has a seemingly well developed ranked playlist. If everyone who supports dark and darker as well as anyone who simply doesn’t want to let nexon bully ironmace off of baseless claims for what simply seems like jealousy, I wonder if it would help. Threatening to force their two newest projects which by all accounts should do well otherwise seems like the only real way we can help ironmace. There is no doubt in my mind that people would support it and it would likely get at least 10’s of thousands of signatures especially if someone like moist critical brings it to the communities attention since he seems to support ironmace and dislike nexon already. Thoughts?
Wurter2023/03/29(水) 09:44
I hope Nexon shuts these fuckers down
Hyper Lethality2023/03/29(水) 09:44
I get you have too engage in a certain level of click baiting,
But the way you phrase that title adds fuel too nexon's fire.
We already have a ton of people from a certain place defending nexon like crazy.
But the way you phrase that title adds fuel too nexon's fire.
We already have a ton of people from a certain place defending nexon like crazy.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 09:50
If people go by title alone, that isn’t going to sway an opinion.
Arcane Armor2023/03/30(木) 05:17
I'm not tracking. How is this title click bait? Is it not factually accurate? Is it not art from the game Dark and Darker that Nexon is claiming is theirs? Out of all the things that are adding fuel to the Nexon fire (hashtags, review bombs, etc.) this isn't on even on the map.
Coffee Fresh2023/03/29(水) 09:43
Nexon or ironmace. I don't care who wins.
Shawn Williams2023/03/29(水) 09:41
we need to spport ironmace with FU MONEY!
Obiss 12312023/03/29(水) 09:27
You should check out the Devin Nash video on this, it could give you a bit more insight on the matter. From his prospective he thinks DnD is doomed and this lawsuit will stand.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 09:36
Of course it will stand. Nexon can drag this on forever my man
Ty Liss2023/03/30(木) 03:44
@Onepeg Knowing that then with the big corp with money to outlast Ironmace who not only scrapped together funds for making the game and now can't launch it to make more, but can't afford the same kind of legal team as the big guys, I ask this. What's our best hope for this? Not that they've asked obviously but GoFundMe, more publicity to reach charitable lawyers? Or is that also not viable due to the fact it's Korean Law so not as likely to be useful?
Redwood Northerner2023/03/29(水) 09:22
I hope this shit gets thrown out of court. Ffs it's corporate bullying.
Brennan Orr2023/03/29(水) 09:22
Don't settle and sue for loss of profits they will no longer want to sit in court with them as they will have to pay legal fees when they lose and also have to pay out estimated profit loss for the game being taken down forcefully with out legal reasoning
justin Kedgetor2023/03/29(水) 09:12
As someone that was a big fan of Nexon NAs (before they closed/ withdrew their NA location) game Combat Arms from the early 2000s I can say as a company Nexon practices may money grabbing techniques in their in-game stores.
This and the lack of hack prevention and removal of cheaters ruined the game. I'm convinced Nexon is grasping at straws with this case . My worst fear is they purposely drag the case into the mud to bankrupt Ironmace. However their claims so weak that I doubt it'll go that far.
Just my 2 cents :)
This and the lack of hack prevention and removal of cheaters ruined the game. I'm convinced Nexon is grasping at straws with this case . My worst fear is they purposely drag the case into the mud to bankrupt Ironmace. However their claims so weak that I doubt it'll go that far.
Just my 2 cents :)
justin Kedgetor2023/03/29(水) 09:31
@Brettness you're not the only one that blew that kinda money on that game. The first 5 is years of it were amazing dude. I miss those times and game , now I play EFT coz I hate myself haha
Brettness2023/03/29(水) 09:52
@justin Kedgetor LOL. I watch Doc play it sometimes and I just can't do that slow pace anymore. Definitely a good game tho.
Brettness2023/03/29(水) 09:52
Just remembered it was called Cabin Fever in Combat Arms
justin Kedgetor2023/03/29(水) 10:01
@Brettness yeah quarantine was the mode for zombie players and mercs iirc
justin Kedgetor2023/03/29(水) 10:07
@Brettness just hold down your W key and go full zug bro
Stephen2023/03/29(水) 09:12
Big battle pass industry is funding nexon to destroy Ironmace before they can save the gaming industry 😢
Aztal2023/03/29(水) 09:11
God I hope Nexon gets slapped down in court, such an evil company
IDK2023/03/30(木) 12:13
Nexon sucks!
Renkou @ Limb[it]less Gaming2023/03/29(水) 09:10
the p3 barb looks like a hacked photoshop job...there's white under its armpit and the characters outlining seems jagged, doesn't seem to blend with the background compared to DaD 🤣
Rhawkas2023/03/29(水) 09:06
~ 17:17 "The question is whether or not you can say something is a trade secret when it was bought at Wal-Mart." I'm pretty sure the purchased assets are not what Nexon is claiming the "stolen assets" are, it's the code that was leaked and the knowledge of the project the employees took with them when they left the company. A comparison of the code of the two projects would clear this situation up real quick.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 09:09
Agree, however they are basing their original arguments on assets, and did not mention source code in their arguments. Rather, they remark on the arrangement of those assets
Brennan Orr2023/03/29(水) 09:27
Well considering they posted unreal sorce code as the things that were copy written means they are trying to make something from nothing and hope somone with no sense of how programming works to blindly take there side
PrometheusOne2023/03/29(水) 08:58
nice
Timothy2023/03/29(水) 08:54
Great video!
Dephside2023/03/29(水) 08:53
nexon just salty they cancelled the wrong project
debish vebish wish2023/03/29(水) 08:53
Unfortunately Korean law never favors the small company, and always favor the big corpos. Hell, that whole country is run by big corpos. SK is a real life Cyberpunk 2077
Insam2023/03/30(木) 07:49
머라노 인종차별자냐? 대통령도 탄핵하는데 헛소리 지리노
4hire2023/03/29(水) 08:50
By their logic Nexon should be suing everyone that ever played DND lol
Desesh Gaming2023/03/29(水) 08:49
I honestly think Ironmace should sue Nexon for deformation, this is as ridiculous as saying elder scrolls and two worlds ripped each other off or any other two slightly similar games in the same genre EA isn't suing Activison for stealing battlefield when they made ground war which made the game play almost like a battlefield game. I just hope this gets settled quickly in favor of Ironmace so we can get back to focusing on them building a much better game.
Fidel Shrogin2023/03/29(水) 10:38
Defamation*
Paja Angus2023/03/30(木) 05:59
Valve debería demandar a Tencen para eliminar a Riot Game por copiar a Dota y CCGO, según Nexon Alkskafslkjaf
Timothy2023/03/29(水) 08:45
all this work based on UE4 assets... amazing. I love these devs, you can tell they are so so passionate about dark and darker.
hebo gumbo2023/03/29(水) 08:45
Nexons lawyers could make a very good rebuttal to all these points unfortunately
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 08:47
Any talented lawyer could
5 Solas2023/03/29(水) 08:44
Kick rocks Nexon.
FPS_Scotland2023/03/29(水) 08:42
Smoke and mirrors. Look at the code, case closed either way.
Travis2023/03/29(水) 08:41
Literally the concept art is extremely similar to each other.
Travis2023/03/30(木) 01:01
@Blake Harpster exactly
Kari Virkelä2023/03/30(木) 02:10
@Blake Harpster Just wait for the court decisions, we will see then.
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 03:12
@Kari Virkelä I agree wait for the court decision It’s obvious this is the same exact game that they were working on while being contracted employees at Nexon Which means legally they are GG
Neptine Auras2023/03/30(木) 06:54
@Blake Harpster you act like you know the outcome when nexon still hasn’t shown there side yet
Kari Virkelä2023/03/30(木) 09:08
@Blake Harpster To me it's not obvious at all :S
Pobs2023/03/29(水) 08:40
If this is the argument then Wizards of the Coast might as well sue Nexon for stealing their classes' style.
Probably Fat2023/03/29(水) 08:31
Man I just hope we ge a update on the play test lol! I need my Dark and Darker
IDK2023/03/29(水) 11:56
Yes please il do anything
JOE XD2023/03/29(水) 08:30
Jee the cat scared me lol!
JustHunt212023/03/29(水) 08:29
Nexon better have evidence against Ironmace, otherwise Steam should remove DMCA takedown on Dark and Darker and allow Ironmace conduct their business.
artur gottselig2023/03/29(水) 08:26
Can you please talk about one of the nexon devs using a private server where p3 data was saved that nexon provided because of covid so he can work from home but after getting told from nexon that he isnt allowed to use the server on his private pc anymore he still did it and thats one of the reasons nexon thinks he stole the game there is a whole post about it on the dark and darker reddit.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 08:34
literally in my last video on this topic from 2 days ago.
artur gottselig2023/03/29(水) 08:47
@Onepeg oh then im sorry i didnt see it i will watch it now and i wanted to ask because i have no understanding about stuff like that is steam obligated to restore dark and darker even if ironmace wins because its a private site owned by big gabe or could ironmace sue them ? and if they DO sue steam are they obligated to reinstate the game? (sry for bad english its my third language)
Andragil7172023/03/29(水) 11:07
@artur gottselig If Ironmace counter claimed the DMCA notice then Nexon has 14 days from that point on to take it to court or it's waived. Steam in this time (from the counter claim on) need to rerelease the game not sooner than 10 days but not later than 14. Considering a court case was not filed by Nexon in the meantime. (Was sourced on reddit with links to of what exact law/policy this is based on. It's specific to the DMCA and that the game would be still on the platform otherwise and was already accepted once.)
It doesn't mean that Steam can't take it of after this on different claims than the DMCA if they wanted to of course. But why would they. If they keep to these rules can't be held legally responsible and it means good money to them. After all Dark and Darker is the most wishlisted game on Steam (or at least it was).
It doesn't mean that Steam can't take it of after this on different claims than the DMCA if they wanted to of course. But why would they. If they keep to these rules can't be held legally responsible and it means good money to them. After all Dark and Darker is the most wishlisted game on Steam (or at least it was).
Jimmysjohn2023/03/29(水) 08:22
Arma can just sue all of the BRs if we use this logic. Games like Fortnite, Apex, and PUBG should also be removed. Think how stupid that logic is. All of these BRs got the idea of a loot and shoot battle royal from Arma.
Nevvil Wildman2023/03/29(水) 08:15
The way that werid Nexon legal thing about proprietary stuff sounds like a non-compete so idk why they are going after claiming about assets or concepts are stolen, when the only thing ironmace may be guilty of is pulling a Bender from futurama and going off to make their own game, with balckjack and hookers.
Andragil7172023/03/29(水) 11:17
They want the game for themself which is real popular from the start. Faster than developing P3. All they need is to add some mtx and p2w for some Nexon flavor and boom... money shower.
Nightshift Customs2023/03/29(水) 08:11
so if you wanted to not be like P3 then why would you go out of your way to buy and pay for assets that are all the same as the one's used in P3
with the endless amounts of assets choice's out there seems pretty dumb to me
and don't say cuz they had/owned them as they didn't. but Nexon did when they were working for them
with the endless amounts of assets choice's out there seems pretty dumb to me
and don't say cuz they had/owned them as they didn't. but Nexon did when they were working for them
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 08:21
the unreal store/associated stores don't have tons of market assets. there are retail games all over the place that use the same assets that DaD is using.
Nightshift Customs2023/03/29(水) 09:43
@Onepeg there is 31.495 thousand assets on the market atm
Anonimo Lindo2023/03/29(水) 08:10
THE COOOOOPIUM, ironmace clearly stole the assets
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 01:20
It’s not the assets It’s the idea and concept of the game It’s obvious all of this was designed and planned out while they worked for Nexon And likely had a contract that restricts them from stealing intellectual property It’s GG
Timothy2023/03/30(木) 01:45
@Blake Harpster Then prove it. Surely they would have some evidence of that? Surely? Not just circumstantial whatever the hell this is. You'd think if the case was that open shut this would have ended YEARS ago. Lmao
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 02:14
@Timothy They do have evidence that’s why their going to court Your telling me to prove it ? It will be proven in time
Have you not seen the screenshot from P3 that’s has all of the same features of dark and darker ?
Have you not seen the screenshot from P3 that’s has all of the same features of dark and darker ?
Neptine Auras2023/03/30(木) 07:17
@Blake Harpster can’t steal an idea though
Neptine Auras2023/03/30(木) 07:18
@Blake Harpster nexon Hasn’t released evidence to the public at all yet and basing something on screenshots is such bs cause you have to base it off the actually code not just how it looks
Assumed 2023/03/29(水) 08:09
not looking good for DandD
Bart L2023/03/29(水) 08:05
Hoesntly saying.. we could claim that Nexon is copy pasting the other artists ideas.. All of those ideas are so similar to each other that it's hard to claim that one steals from another.. I think all of them reference one another. What I am more interested rather is a code of the game and network and all of the things that actually make the game work.
The models.. yeah.. they will have similarities.. and they are all similar to each other (other artists concept art, nexon concept art and ironmace concept art. They are all very similar to eachother.)
Also it's important how the models look like in the game.. maybe that's what's paining the Nexon.. That even though Ironmace is using different concepts their game looks very similar to their game which in truth is hard to pull off.
Maybe that could be a bad example but look at the CS 2 and CS:GO. They're both games developed by the same team and same company and yet they're slightly different from each other visually and mechanically. When I saw Ironmace DnD and Nexon's game's few screenshots, all I could say that they're very, very similar games in appearance. However, when it comes to gameplay.. we don't know what P3 gameplay looks like.. maybe it's also the same or very similar.
The models.. yeah.. they will have similarities.. and they are all similar to each other (other artists concept art, nexon concept art and ironmace concept art. They are all very similar to eachother.)
Also it's important how the models look like in the game.. maybe that's what's paining the Nexon.. That even though Ironmace is using different concepts their game looks very similar to their game which in truth is hard to pull off.
Maybe that could be a bad example but look at the CS 2 and CS:GO. They're both games developed by the same team and same company and yet they're slightly different from each other visually and mechanically. When I saw Ironmace DnD and Nexon's game's few screenshots, all I could say that they're very, very similar games in appearance. However, when it comes to gameplay.. we don't know what P3 gameplay looks like.. maybe it's also the same or very similar.
WeeberDeeper2023/03/29(水) 09:15
Its the same artist that did the concept art, so it's kind of hard to not make it look like the other one, but he did a good job making it different enough for D&D
Bart L2023/03/29(水) 10:59
@WeeberDeeper true that. We gotta see what p3 project is really like to determine who is copying from who.
SeeZaa2023/03/30(木) 01:49
Haven't they already been raided, and investigated, by police, for allegedly stolen intellectual property.. code, assets, etc.. with nothing of interest found, nor recovered?
Denthony_2023/03/29(水) 08:05
this feels like community coping
SkadoooshTV2023/03/29(水) 08:03
So by Nexon's logic shouldn't the owners of D&D and then Magick sue Nexon for admitting they were designing characters based on their designs? Like Nexon is trying to copyright the idea of these characters, which was created well before they tried. They feel like they back themselves into a corner because those products are sold in Korea already, so should be protected by their law already, and Nexon trying to copyright what is already being sold is probably super illegal anyways. Iron Mace just needs to hang in there because it feels more like Nexon is trying to run them out of money in a legal fight.
general chAOS2023/03/29(水) 08:00
It's crazy cause this actually makes more of a case for Nexon then Ironmace, the fact that their lawyers okayed this probably means they are screwed. The only thing Ironmace has on their side is the goodwill of a large portion of the gaming community. The more they talk the more they prove the case of Nexon.
Deangelo Granados2023/03/29(水) 08:07
not at all lol this only proves what we all know and its that nexon has the money to harass iron mace
So Pro TV2023/03/29(水) 07:55
I swear that nexon game thats really popular was exacly like final fantasy. Just a different art style.
Thiago2023/03/29(水) 07:48
I have being a software developer for more than 20 years, and I would say the only way to know it would be looking at the code and comparing the LOGIC. It's very fast and easy to change all the names, files and assets, but not the logic.
Shuikai2023/03/29(水) 11:11
I think the issue is that Nexon is referencing the Korean law regarding "trade secrets", not copyright.
Here's the law:
2. The term "trade secret" means information, including a production method, sale method, useful technical or business information for business activities, that is not known publicly, is the subject of reasonable efforts to maintain its secrecy, and has independent economic value;
So they may allege that Ironmace stole trade secrets, when they developed and released Dark and Darker. Basically, the concept of Dark and Darker, it's a FPS, PvM + PvP, battle royale, extraction, dungeons and dragons-inspired video game. As far as I have seen nothing like that exists other than Dark and Darker.
Ironmace could also argue that the concept can't constitute a trade secret because Nexon made information about P3 public. As far as I have seen there isn't much publicly available on the web though, other than:
'P3', an adventure in medieval dungeons with friends. He emphasized that he plans to expand the area of fun that Nexon has not tried.
With an accompanying screenshot of the game, which the screenshot realistically I think has a LOT more information you could glean off of, however there are many elements which you would not be able to know, such as the fact the game is an extraction-based game, there is a thing that says "portal" in the image but no way for anyone to know where they lead to, what they do, etc. Also many other aspects of the game, like you can't really argue that developing P3 didn't help them develop Dark and Darker, even if they didn't use the same code it's a lot easier to make the game over again than to make it from scratch.
The thing that I can't figure out is why Nexon is so focused on them stealing the source code, and that the source code is maybe like a part of the game. I don't know if maybe they are using this angle just to make Ironmace look bad, or if the above argument of "trade secret" doesn't qualify and so they are hoping they can get them on copying source code.
So I'm not sure how the court could rule, one way or the other, but I do think that it seems grey enough that I would be hoping that Ironmace can reach a legal agreement with Nexon so that both parties can benefit, rather than a mutually assured destruction type of situation. I mean fuck if they want to actually go to court, that just gives everyone else a huge opportunity to capitalize on the situation and make their own Dark and Darker game while they're stuck in limbo.
Also, if you're a game developer I guess the lesson here is that if you have a great idea, don't tell your employer about it or they will claim ownership of it.
Here's the law:
2. The term "trade secret" means information, including a production method, sale method, useful technical or business information for business activities, that is not known publicly, is the subject of reasonable efforts to maintain its secrecy, and has independent economic value;
So they may allege that Ironmace stole trade secrets, when they developed and released Dark and Darker. Basically, the concept of Dark and Darker, it's a FPS, PvM + PvP, battle royale, extraction, dungeons and dragons-inspired video game. As far as I have seen nothing like that exists other than Dark and Darker.
Ironmace could also argue that the concept can't constitute a trade secret because Nexon made information about P3 public. As far as I have seen there isn't much publicly available on the web though, other than:
'P3', an adventure in medieval dungeons with friends. He emphasized that he plans to expand the area of fun that Nexon has not tried.
With an accompanying screenshot of the game, which the screenshot realistically I think has a LOT more information you could glean off of, however there are many elements which you would not be able to know, such as the fact the game is an extraction-based game, there is a thing that says "portal" in the image but no way for anyone to know where they lead to, what they do, etc. Also many other aspects of the game, like you can't really argue that developing P3 didn't help them develop Dark and Darker, even if they didn't use the same code it's a lot easier to make the game over again than to make it from scratch.
The thing that I can't figure out is why Nexon is so focused on them stealing the source code, and that the source code is maybe like a part of the game. I don't know if maybe they are using this angle just to make Ironmace look bad, or if the above argument of "trade secret" doesn't qualify and so they are hoping they can get them on copying source code.
So I'm not sure how the court could rule, one way or the other, but I do think that it seems grey enough that I would be hoping that Ironmace can reach a legal agreement with Nexon so that both parties can benefit, rather than a mutually assured destruction type of situation. I mean fuck if they want to actually go to court, that just gives everyone else a huge opportunity to capitalize on the situation and make their own Dark and Darker game while they're stuck in limbo.
Also, if you're a game developer I guess the lesson here is that if you have a great idea, don't tell your employer about it or they will claim ownership of it.
Commander Conquer2023/03/29(水) 11:30
That would be rather interesting and, as you said, would be a lot better proof than anything else. Imho there is too much focus in these discussions on "did they literally copy & paste assets/code".
If the devs worked on P3, left Nexon, and then basically recreated it from memory as Dark & Darker it would speed up the development time immensely. Not sure if illegal, but imho shady.
If the devs worked on P3, left Nexon, and then basically recreated it from memory as Dark & Darker it would speed up the development time immensely. Not sure if illegal, but imho shady.
Shannen2023/03/30(木) 12:37
I think everyone is looking at it in the wrong way / the way Iron Mace is presenting it, the issue is that IP also pertains to the techniques and specific knowledge gained while working there which is actually owned by Nexon, the fact they used the exact same paid assets HURTS them as it can be argued that the knowledge on how to take each separate asset and merge them (especially in such a similar way) is IP owned by Nexon along with the idea that they used knowledge (IP) they obtained working on P3 to avoid multiple design pitfalls and large iteration time.
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 12:52
Speaking facts I think that some people’s opinions can be greatly one sided because if the fact that they love the game. I have a feeling that more info will come out regarding the design of P3. Things like multiple levels, similar enemies, portals to escape into, a closing zone. If that is the case I think it’s GG for DaD They aren’t gonna let ironmace make tons of money from their game
Paja Angus2023/03/30(木) 05:54
@Blake Harpster that continues to earn nexus with its crappy generic games being a AAA company that does not innovate for fear of economic failure? May they die sooner by disease than dethrone d&d, amen.
Helium Freak2023/03/29(水) 07:44
The Winklevoss twins hired Zuckerberg to make a website for them, he ended up going off and making his own website with their idea. He then had to pay them a settlement because what he did was illegal.
How is this any different? Nexon hired them to make a game, they left and made the same game by themselves.
*In regards to the wrap up at the end of your video. You seem to be focusing too much on "Look at all these other examples of xxx from xxx" . And sure, in a completely neutral setting, with neutrally involved parties, sure, i would agree with you.
But these arent neutral parties, they worked directly on another project, they are involved, you cant use the same example.
How is this any different? Nexon hired them to make a game, they left and made the same game by themselves.
*In regards to the wrap up at the end of your video. You seem to be focusing too much on "Look at all these other examples of xxx from xxx" . And sure, in a completely neutral setting, with neutrally involved parties, sure, i would agree with you.
But these arent neutral parties, they worked directly on another project, they are involved, you cant use the same example.
Esp Ni2023/03/29(水) 07:43
People love to support the smaller guy. But in this situation. Something isn’t right. And I wouldn’t go to a guy who is biased and looking for reasons to support ironmace rather than be right down the middle. Which we all know you are not. I would urge people to hear both sides. Not just this guy.
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 01:12
This whole video is extremely biased He goes into every piece of evidence already convinced that Ironmace did nothing wrong Brain dead takes
HellDuke2023/03/29(水) 07:43
Well since they used DMCA to have Steam remove the game... Don't Ironmace get to challenge and have it be "Either Steam puts the game back up or you literally sue us over this right now"
gplr18822023/03/29(水) 08:25
Afaik steam will remove a game if it gets a DMCA or some lawsuit against it for 10-14 days, and put it back up on the store if the situation isn't resolved. So here's hoping we see it up on the store real soon.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 08:27
yes they still have another 7 or so business days to dispute it.
Cary Rumley2023/03/29(水) 07:39
Yeah idk if anyone gets to claim they own anything that looks vaguely Nordic. Or like a "fighter" which is apparently anyone in armor with weapons?
RodentForce 2023/03/29(水) 07:34
None of these concept art claims are valid. Nexon are the LAST people to be saying they own the fantasy genre and everything in it.
Donald McFinnigan III2023/03/29(水) 07:33
Lmao good thing your not a lawyer
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 08:31
you're*
Donald McFinnigan III2023/03/29(水) 08:57
@Onepeg touché
Colce2023/03/29(水) 07:29
I mean, looking past the clear bias since he's been sponsored by them in the past. Honestly it looks like they definitely have some substance to the claim of theft of intellectual property as well as design assets. He's really reaching in the video to try to show how the projects are different. I'm sure people in the comment section who is supporting Ironmace would be upset too if they paid someone to work on a project, they underperformed (seemingly intentionally), so you reasonably fired them. Then they attempt to beat you to the punch on releasing the project that wasn't something they spent money researching/writing the design of to begin with. It was simply something that was their job to execute, which they decided to see as dollar signs and secretly plan to steal.
Coeur2023/03/29(水) 08:07
I mean, you say "looking past the bias" and then make a whole lot of aspersions as to what they're doing with some pretty hefty bias of your own. You can't pretend to be the unbiased one when you're then suggesting Nexon "reasonably fired them for underperforming (actually, most of them apparently left of their own choice so that's either incorrect info on your part or a falsehood)" and that they beat you to the punch on something you were researching (keeping in mind Nexon only filed copyright for this in March 2023), and you say they had a job to execute but saw dollar signs - which doesn't fit with the fact that even if it was P3, P3 was shelved as per Nexon's own commentary. That's... what? Three? Four instances of you making assumptions as to their reasons.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 08:23
"sponsored"? I've never been paid by them dog. lol. I just play video games.
Colce2023/03/29(水) 08:24
@Coeur sounds like you are getting all of your info from creators like this and not looking objectively. Neutral reporters who don't stand to gain from the success of Ironmace (like this creator) reported that the employees who formed Ironmace disobeyed being asked to prioritize other projects and secretly continued working on P3/Dark & Darker development while on Nexon's payroll and were fired when it was discovered. And Nexon filed for copyright in February, not March. With proof of development starting in early 2021, before Ironmace was obviously even founded. And the claim of P3 being shelved - in the game development world, companies who are developing 5+ games at once will often shift priorities depending on market projections and available resources, potentially requiring some employees to focus on assets for a different game. This does not, however, give employees the right to leak or steal those intellectual properties that are not the companies #1 priority at the time.
Onepeg2023/03/29(水) 08:30
@Colce if you think the korean press is neutral, you haven't been paying attention to the commenters that have been following this story saying that the korean press is FAR from it. The copyrights were requested in february of THIS YEAR, not 2020/2021. Also you are basing your assumptions of timeline on information fed to the press BY NEXON.
I have given credence multiple times to say that Nexon's timeline COULD BE TRUE, but to say it *IS TRUE* without any proof other than some korean blog articles is incredibly obtuse.
I have given credence multiple times to say that Nexon's timeline COULD BE TRUE, but to say it *IS TRUE* without any proof other than some korean blog articles is incredibly obtuse.
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 01:17
You were extremely biased throughout the whole video I don’t know how you convinced yourself that the art models are “not even close” But it’s obvious you are glazing DaD
H B2023/03/29(水) 07:29
I have no negative comments about this video, but I feel those very interested should also look at this issue from different perspectives. Devin Nash has a video that goes over many potential problems Iron Mace will have to overcome.
Blake Harpster2023/03/30(木) 01:03
I agree Most people just enjoy the game and instantly side with Ironmace Kinda like the creator of the video He already had his mind set that Ironmace is not guilty and somehow convinced himself that the art models are not almost identical
Neptine Auras2023/03/30(木) 06:46
I watched that video and he missed file names of assets part in video which were an important part
